“The Facts Cannot Be Denied” – a Conversation with Dr Luc Montagnier

By Deborah Hayes, BSc(Hons), CCH, RSHom(NA), NTP


This article was published in The American Homeopath Journal, Volume 18, 2012, and is reproduced with permission.

The homeopathic community was honored to have Dr Luc Montagnier as a speaker at the 2012 Joint Annual Homeopathic Conference in Reston, VA.  Dr Montagnier was awarded the 2008 Nobel Prize for Physiology and Medicine as a result of his work identifying HIV as the cause of AIDS.  Some of his more recent research has led him in an unexpected and controversial direction, showing that certain dilutions of bacterial and viral DNA sequences can emit low frequency electromagnetic waves. 

These electromagnetic signals carry information about the DNA.  Under certain conditions, the electromagnetic signals from a tube containing a highly diluted solution of DNA sequences can transmit information to a second tube containing only purified water.  If the chemicals for polymerase chain reaction are added to the signalized water in the second tube, the original DNA sequence can be duplicated with 98-100% accuracy.  In his presentation, Dr Montagnier also explained that in his most recent research, his team had transmitted the electromagnetic signals digitally between computers and had succeeded in replicating the DNA in a distant laboratory.

The results suggest that nanostructures comprised of water molecules are produced as a result of the EMS. These nanostructures, which Dr Montagnier terms “naneons,” are destroyed by temperatures over 70°C, by electromagnetic fields and by freezing.  Dr Montagnier pointed out that the water in our bodies is comprised of nanostructures.  His physicist colleagues propose that the stable nanostructures in water emerge as coherent quantum domains that are surrounded by an electron cloud, are relatively stable and have the ability to carry information when diluted to a sufficiently high degree.

Dr Montagnier posited that perhaps the DNA double helix itself is not read, but rather it is the water structure that surrounds it that carries the essential information: “Without water, the double helix cannot stand.”

Homeopaths will find it particularly interesting that in order to produce the electromagnetic signal, the diluted sample had to be succussed.

At the end of his presentation, Dr Montagnier received a standing ovation and was practically mobbed by members of the audience, who were eager to shake his hand.  Dr Montagnier was gracious enough to pose for photographs with many of his admirers.  I was able to speak with him for a few minutes before he had to leave.

Deborah Hayes: You have been treated as if you are a rock star! What do you make of your reception by the homeopathic community?

Luc Montagnier: It touches me, because, you know sometimes, while I’m not discouraged by certain negative reactions, still it is touching to have such a positive response. But ignorance still exists, and the will of some people is to demolish everything I say.  

I am not alone in this fight, but we are a minority of scientists, and the majority of scientists still want to eliminate everything which is linked with Jacques Benveniste and homeopathy, especially in France.  But Benveniste was an honest man; he had difficulty proving what he found because he was working with biological systems.  He was measuring biological activity.  On the contrary, we are starting with measuring the signals of chemical structures, which are developed in water, so we don’t have difficulty in reproducing these structures. 

We have to take into account that if two plastic tubes are close together, one control and one containing DNA emitting something, the control can capture some of the information in the water from electromagnetic radiation. The second problem is human beings.  If you have too many people in a room where you are doing the experiment it can fail.  We discovered this more recently when we tried to export our technology. So many people were so interested to observe the experiment at the same time. We realized that not more than two people could be in the same lab for the experiment. 

DH: To what do you attribute that?

LM:  The fact is that people are also emitting waves.  And some, for unknown reasons, are emitting waves that will counteract the waves that we are measuring.  So definitely, the experiments are reproduced in labs in several parts of the world, but our colleagues must take precautions and follow our protocol.

DH: Your work involves using a vortex to reproduce the process of succession.  What led you to do this?

LM: In the beginning we used and adapted mostly the techniques of Jacques Benveniste.

DH: Where do you think your work takes us in terms of where homeopathic research needs to go next?

LM: I am pursuing my own research.  But I keep an open mind to homeopathic research.

DH: Can you explain to our readers who were not able to attend your talk today, and who may not be familiar with your work, what are the key outcomes of your research?

LM: The key is that first, there are waves, low frequency waves that transmit information, like submarines talking to each other. One can hypothesize that these waves may help explain the origin of life.  There is much research now in science that is just analytical, essentially trying to see which genes are expressed at certain times. This is important. But it doesn’t show what is the engine of these processes.  In embryogenesis, there is a harmonious succession of gene expression that is originated from the DNA.  I believe this is mediated by the waves emitted by DNA.  The genes are expressed in a precise order; the DNA is played like the notes in a musical symphony.  So it is a way to explain the origin of a complex individual, like ourselves. 

DH: And water is very important.

LM: Water, of course, is key, and waves. 

DH: The memory of water.

LM: Yes, the memory of water. In homeopathy that of course fits.  Carrying accurate information.

DH: Yesterday at the conference there was a presentation by Jeremy Sherr about his work on the treatment of AIDS in Africa using homeopathy. He has shown cures with levels of virus dropping to undetectable levels.

LM: Possibly, but the problem with HIV/AIDS is that the situation varies from one patient to another.  It is very difficult to make a statistical study.  There are several types of variability. We are trying to study these variabilities in terms of DNA emission, EMS transmission and co-factors.  It’s very complex.

DH: Do you think that that the scientific community will accept the idea of transmission of information via the memory of water, of your work?

LM: This will come.  We are making progress, slowly, but definitely in being reproduced by other laboratories.

DH: Do you think they will ever accept the tenets of homeopathy?

LM: Why not?  They are facts, you know.  If one can explain the homeopathic phenomena in a rational way, if you show there are people cured by homeopathy, the facts cannot be denied.

DH: People do try to deny it!

LM: People do try, but I think that there are economic interests to keep out everything that is outside the mainstream and that of course includes homeopathy.

DH:  Thank you so much for taking the time to speak with me on behalf of American Homeopath’s readers.  With that we went our separate ways, leaving the lecture room still buzzing with people enthused by Dr Montagnier’s presentation.

If you would like to find out more about Dr Montagnier’s research, you may go to his web site http://montagnier.org.  The articles he has published on this phenomenon are: “Electromagnetic Signals are Produced by Aqueous Nanostructures Derived from Bacterial DNA Sequences.”  Interdiscip Sci Comput Life Sci (2009) and  “DNA Waves and Water.” Journal of Physics: Conference Series 306 (2011) 012007.

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